Clarification Re: Elsie Vinyl Pressings

So I was curious about future pressings of Elsie and I sent the following email to SideOneDummy:

> Message:
> Hi there. I have a question about the vinyl pressing of the Horrible
> Crowes.
>
> I see that the black vinyl is a more limited pressing than the red
> vinyl.
>
> What color will be used for later pressings? If the later pressings
> are going to be on black, will there be a way to distinguish between a
> first press black and a second press black? I'd really appreciate any
> info you can give me on this.
>
> Thanks,

In response I got the following reply:

>The black is not as limited as the red...there were 1,500 of each color
>pressed...all future represses will be on black vinyl...and on the matrix
>that is scratched into the interior ring of the vinyl there is always a
>digit that notes the pressing usually you will see a one crossed out
>followed by a 2 and so on and so forth...we have already pressed another 500
>units of the black vinyl because we totally sold out of the 1st
>pressing...the red vinyl will probably go very quick as well

So, for those who care, it looks like the red is actually the most limited pressing of Elsie.

I guess you could say that black and red are "tied" for rarest to the extent you have a black "first pressing" (since there were apparently 1500 of each initially pressed). As the email from SideOne says, however, the only way to tell if your black copy is a first pressing is by the matrix scratched onto the record.

As a collector, I'm not sure it really matters if my black copy is a "first pressing" if the only difference is the matrix etching. In other words, when assessing which pressing of a record is the rarest, I think it makes the most sense to go by which color is the rarest. If there are thousands of copies on black, I don't think it makes much sense to say that one black copy is "rarer" than another based on the matrix etching (as opposed to say, differences on the outer jacket). So in my book, the black version is really not a limited pressing at all.

ouch!

thanks for this

that's really bad, saying they pressed 1,300 black and now it's actually 1,500

generally speaking, first pressing rarity still stands, even if records are re-pressed in the same colour

Looks to me like S1D screwed up pretty bad on informing us what was limited to what (Vinyl and Poster wise).

What's next? They'll press 1000 more Horrible Crowes 7"s and give them out as samplers?

So, if yesterday i ordered one from amazon, what color should i expect to get?

Phil Rockabill wrote:

So, if yesterday i ordered one from amazon, what color should i expect to get?

black

Where did S1D ever say the black was a limited edition pressing? I thought it was fairly clear only the red was and the black was just standard old boring stuff.

Bea wrote:

Phil Rockabill wrote:

So, if yesterday i ordered one from amazon, what color should i expect to get?

black

K.

Btw, just checked and amazon is now out of stock.

CluckyB wrote:

Where did S1D ever say the black was a limited edition pressing? I thought it was fairly clear only the red was and the black was just standard old boring stuff.

I guess most of us presumed it, as it was only available as a pre-order through S1D's website. Plus the fact that they said it was limited to 1300, making it seem more limited than the red pressing.

I personally figured it would be like SOS, the first pressing would be the only black one.

CluckyB wrote:

Where did S1D ever say the black was a limited edition pressing? I thought it was fairly clear only the red was and the black was just standard old boring stuff.

From the SideOneDummy Store @ http://store.sideonedummy.com/the-horrible-crowes-elsie-deluxe-bundle-pre-order.html:

Product Description


For the ubder vinyl nerds (i can say this because i am one) the first pressing of the full lenght LP on black vinyl is limited to 1,300 pieces. The records were pressed at Rainbo Records in Canoga Park, CA. The only other color of vinyl available on this title is the limited edition "blood red" vinyl that can only be found at independent record stores around the US, Canada and UK. The red vinyl is limited to 1,500 copies.

Many people interpreted the above the mean that the black version was going to be more limited than red.

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:

CluckyB wrote:

Where did S1D ever say the black was a limited edition pressing? I thought it was fairly clear only the red was and the black was just standard old boring stuff.

From the SideOneDummy Store @ http://store.sideonedummy.com/the-horrible-crowes-elsie-deluxe-bundle-pre-order.html:

Product Description


For the ubder vinyl nerds (i can say this because i am one) the first pressing of the full lenght LP on black vinyl is limited to 1,300 pieces. The records were pressed at Rainbo Records in Canoga Park, CA. The only other color of vinyl available on this title is the limited edition "blood red" vinyl that can only be found at independent record stores around the US, Canada and UK. The red vinyl is limited to 1,500 copies.

Many people interpreted the above the mean that the black version was going to be more limited than red.

I mean, so it clearly specified "first pressing" for the black, implying there would be more. So is the complaint they are not marked noticeably enough or the 1,300/1,500 typo? Why does having the 200 extra records matter? Doesn't that just mean 200 more people can get it? Seems like the only reason you'd care is if you plan on selling it later which seems like a kinda selfish move.

CluckyB wrote:

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:

CluckyB wrote:

Where did S1D ever say the black was a limited edition pressing? I thought it was fairly clear only the red was and the black was just standard old boring stuff.

From the SideOneDummy Store @ http://store.sideonedummy.com/the-horrible-crowes-elsie-deluxe-bundle-pre-order.html:

Product Description


For the ubder vinyl nerds (i can say this because i am one) the first pressing of the full lenght LP on black vinyl is limited to 1,300 pieces. The records were pressed at Rainbo Records in Canoga Park, CA. The only other color of vinyl available on this title is the limited edition "blood red" vinyl that can only be found at independent record stores around the US, Canada and UK. The red vinyl is limited to 1,500 copies.

Many people interpreted the above the mean that the black version was going to be more limited than red.

I mean, so it clearly specified "first pressing" for the black, implying there would be more. So is the complaint they are not marked noticeably enough or the 1,300/1,500 typo? Why does having the 200 extra records matter? Doesn't that just mean 200 more people can get it? Seems like the only reason you'd care is if you plan on selling it later which seems like a kinda selfish move.

I'm kinda bummed because I bought the black instead of the red, because it was made out to be rarer and I think it's kinda cool to own rare things more for personal value, not financial. So if I had of known that There are 1500 of each, I would've gone for the red, because it's prettier. And there will be more pressings, that's inevitable, so yes, I'm mad that the black record was made to be more valuable than it is.

CluckyB wrote:

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:

CluckyB wrote:

Where did S1D ever say the black was a limited edition pressing? I thought it was fairly clear only the red was and the black was just standard old boring stuff.

From the SideOneDummy Store @ http://store.sideonedummy.com/the-horrible-crowes-elsie-deluxe-bundle-pre-order.html:

Product Description


For the ubder vinyl nerds (i can say this because i am one) the first pressing of the full lenght LP on black vinyl is limited to 1,300 pieces. The records were pressed at Rainbo Records in Canoga Park, CA. The only other color of vinyl available on this title is the limited edition "blood red" vinyl that can only be found at independent record stores around the US, Canada and UK. The red vinyl is limited to 1,500 copies.

Many people interpreted the above the mean that the black version was going to be more limited than red.

I mean, so it clearly specified "first pressing" for the black, implying there would be more. So is the complaint they are not marked noticeably enough or the 1,300/1,500 typo? Why does having the 200 extra records matter? Doesn't that just mean 200 more people can get it? Seems like the only reason you'd care is if you plan on selling it later which seems like a kinda selfish move.

I have zero interest in selling my black copy later. I care about this because I want accurate information. Instead of collecting all variants, I collect only the rarest first pressing of records. SideOneDummy originally stated that the black was the most limited first pressing. According to the new information I received, this is not the case. I'm now sharing that information with the rest of the forum. If you don't care then you don't care. Good for you.

steady now steady now wrote:

ouch!

generally speaking, first pressing rarity still stands, even if records are re-pressed in the same colour

That's fair enough. So for something like the black 2x7 pressing of S&TQ on black, would that still be considered a first press limited to 1000 even though Sabot has repressed the black version?

I realize what a nerd this makes me but I really enjoy discussing this stuff.

I don't care what anyone say's, I'm pretty pissed about this. I was misinformed. I was planning on buying the red anyway, but was thinking if I don't get it, oh well, I'd have the rarest of the two, but now that is clearly not the case. So now I have to search for the red vinyl with more urgency and tbh, I'm having a hard damn time finding one! If anyone know's where I can get the blood red vinyl online, I'd greatly appreciate it!

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:

steady now steady now wrote:

ouch!

generally speaking, first pressing rarity still stands, even if records are re-pressed in the same colour

That's fair enough. So for something like the black 2x7 pressing of S&TQ on black, would that still be considered a first press limited to 1000 even though Sabot has repressed the black version?

I realize what a nerd this makes me but I really enjoy discussing this stuff.

yes, the first press would still be limited, because the re-pressing is, after all, a second pressing

as for Elsie's second pressing of 500, as they don't seem to be sold with a 'second pressing' tag, are they really a separate pressing for collector's purposes?

i'm totally lost in this conversation... all i have to say is:

carryon820 wrote:

I don't care what anyone say's, I'm pretty pissed about this. I was misinformed. I was planning on buying the red anyway, but was thinking if I don't get it, oh well, I'd have the rarest of the two, but now that is clearly not the case. So now I have to search for the red vinyl with more urgency and tbh, I'm having a hard damn time finding one! If anyone know's where I can get the blood red vinyl online, I'd greatly appreciate it!

Check your inbox.

Bea wrote:

Phil Rockabill wrote:

So, if yesterday i ordered one from amazon, what color should i expect to get?

black

Again, if everyone tought that the black one was the "limited" one, wouldn't be fair to think that stores like amazon would end up with the red one? I don't know, just asking.

i guess no US stores are selling the red version online?

steady now steady now wrote:

as for Elsie's second pressing of 500, as they don't seem to be sold with a 'second pressing' tag, are they really a separate pressing for collector's purposes?

Good question and one which applies to all variants of the "unlimited" variety (e.g., SoS (clear), American Slang (black), 59 Sound (black) etc.).

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:

CluckyB wrote:

Shrewsbury_Stars wrote:

CluckyB wrote:

Where did S1D ever say the black was a limited edition pressing? I thought it was fairly clear only the red was and the black was just standard old boring stuff.

From the SideOneDummy Store @ http://store.sideonedummy.com/the-horrible-crowes-elsie-deluxe-bundle-pre-order.html:

Product Description


For the ubder vinyl nerds (i can say this because i am one) the first pressing of the full lenght LP on black vinyl is limited to 1,300 pieces. The records were pressed at Rainbo Records in Canoga Park, CA. The only other color of vinyl available on this title is the limited edition "blood red" vinyl that can only be found at independent record stores around the US, Canada and UK. The red vinyl is limited to 1,500 copies.

Many people interpreted the above the mean that the black version was going to be more limited than red.

I mean, so it clearly specified "first pressing" for the black, implying there would be more. So is the complaint they are not marked noticeably enough or the 1,300/1,500 typo? Why does having the 200 extra records matter? Doesn't that just mean 200 more people can get it? Seems like the only reason you'd care is if you plan on selling it later which seems like a kinda selfish move.

I have zero interest in selling my black copy later. I care about this because I want accurate information. Instead of collecting all variants, I collect only the rarest first pressing of records. SideOneDummy originally stated that the black was the most limited first pressing. According to the new information I received, this is not the case. I'm now sharing that information with the rest of the forum. If you don't care then you don't care. Good for you.

I am in this camp as well. NONE of my gaslight (complete collection) will be sold. However, I have bought items from people selling them, in order to complete my collection, based on the market value, which is based on how many copies exist. I paid $275 for SoS on black because we are told that 100 exist. Do I even need to explain how infuriated I'd be if it was suddenly revealed that, actually, 500 of these exist?

First we were told that 1300 have been pressed on black. Now we are told that 1500 have been pressed. This is not okay. We also bought deluxe bundles that, as described, include a poster that is hand numbered. The posters are not hand numbered. This is not okay.

I pre-ordered the album, thinking that I would get the most limited version, but I now I'm really bummed to discover that the red is going to be much more limited. If I would have known this, I wouldn't have pre-ordered. I also really like the red think it looks pretty cool. Now I'm contemplating going out and buying the red version (if I can find it), even though I already have the black. Maybe I can have one to play and one to frame?

good luck in finding it in a store. ALL of the record stores in my area said that they were told that the release date for the vinyl had been pushed back, which is pretty weird since i've heard that some people found it in stores early.

for the correct Elsie pressing info see the new thread at

https://thegaslightanthem.forumotion.com/t3458-correct-elsie-vinyl-pressing-info